Phil: 0:03

Welcome to Take Your Medicine podcast. I am Phil Cowley, pharmacist of 25 years. And the one thing I've learned is you need to listen to your patients. Everything I really learned in pharmacy, I've learned by taking a minute to listen to the patients and their stories. And from that, I think that knowledge needs to be spread to everyone. So that's why I started Take Your Medicine podcast. And today we have the brilliant, beautiful wonder mom. She's got more on her resume than I can even imagine. See on my resume it says Independent pharmacy owner, her starts there. She's got her PharmD which is a doctor of pharmacy. She's gone for fellowships, board certifications. I could keep going but the thing that gets me the most is a hundred publications. Welcome to the show. Dr. Suzanne Soliman Suzy Suzanne Soliman. She's on instagram, and she's an author, which right now I need everybody to go look in Amazon. I ordered mine, but it came too late. It's coming today. Her book is called The Ultimate Guide to Becoming a Medical Science Liaison. Her name is Suzy Soliman and she is just wonderful. Thank you for being on this podcast.

Suzy: 1:08

Thank you. Thanks so much for having me. I'm super excited to be here.

Phil: 1:13

Suzy, um, one thing that you do have going on, which I looked at, is you in 2017, life was a little hectic. Is that right?

Suzy: 1:22

I would say hectic is a good word to describe it. Yes. Very good word.

Phil: 1:27

So, trying to work and have kids is, I mean, personally, so one thing I always look back on my own life and I think to myself, I should have worked less now that my kids are getting older. Like, I don't know. I know that you say that when you're younger, but when you're younger, all you can think of is if I don't do this, my career is going to go a different direction. And I really believe as a parent, there's no winning personally. You're always losing on one front or the other. So I want to take us back to 2017 and I want to hear the whole baseball story. I want to hear the whole thing because this is a huge thing that you did in 2017.

Suzy: 2:01

Uh, yeah, it was so life was crazy. And as you mentioned, I think, you know, as a parent, we struggle because we're trying to do it all. And I think whether you're a mom or you're a dad, you're, you know, you're trying to balance everything. And for me at the time, I, you know, I had finished pharmacy school, I did a residency, I did a fellowship, I was like, you know, I have this great career. I'm able to travel. Uh, at the time I owned my own pharmacy and as you know, I had to work at night and I had to work on the weekends. And, um, that year specifically my, my son was on the baseball team and he was also on the soccer team. And so soccer came first. I missed so many games. Then baseball came and I started and I just felt terrible. And one night You know, it was on a Saturday and all the other moms are there. And I'm just like, why do I have to work on the weekend? Why do I have to work on a holiday? Why am I missing? But I also knew that I didn't want to give up my career. It'd be, you know, so it was, I was just struggling. So I, I went to the internet and, you know, in the middle of the night,'cause that's not what you're supposed to do, but that's what I decided to do. And I went on there and I was like, you know, I can't be the only person struggling with this. And I didn't wanna go to, uh, the local Facebook groups. And I really looked for other pharmacists who might be struggling and I couldn't find one. So at the time I started a group called the Pharmacist Moms Group. Very generic name. And I invited about 30 pharmacists that I knew, maybe 50 pharmacists that I knew who were also moms and that I maybe went to school with or I had done residency with or worked with and within a month, the group was at a thousand and really the focus I think was really just about time management, guilt, lack of quality time, you know, um, Talking about child care concerns, household responsibilities and the group really just took off from there at right now. We're currently at 45,000 members and it just spun. It just spun organically, really. And I found that all of a sudden I wasn't the only person struggling with this and that there was a lot of us struggling.

Phil: 4:09

Yeah, it's a really hard thing. You know, you have to remember that in the pharmacy world, it wasn't too many years ago, they had to pass a law so we could have a bathroom in the pharmacy. So we didn't have to hold it for 10 12 hours a day. So it's not, pharmacy has always been a very interesting place to work because we work really long hours and quite honestly, they don't, um, to this point, they haven't, in general, most of the management groups out there haven't really given us a lot of room to be what we need to be. And so we start our own pharmacies, And then you realize those hours are even worse than the ones you were working before.

Suzy: 4:42

Exactly. Yeah. Yeah. The only benefit was sometimes my kids would be able to come to the pharmacy. So that, that was a little bit easier, but definitely then you're, you're, you know, you're always working when you own a pharmacy, you're working all the time. Even if you're not in the pharmacy, you're still probably working. So, you know, and shutting that off. And I think just juggling the younger children, I think, you know, is a lot more difficult than, you know, when they're under five, for me at least, it was just It's crazy. Like this one's here, this one's here, this one's there and, and, um, and all of that. But knowing that there was a community or other people that women I could relate to that just felt the demands, the stress, the burnout, all of that. Um, but still wanting to be there for our kids and, you know, make it to their soccer games and make it to their baseball games and still be there for our patients, I think really helped, at least me. Uh, it definitely helped me.

Phil: 5:38

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Suzy: 7:31

Yeah, yeah, there really are. I get messages and emails every single day from pharmacists who are asking, you know, to look for non traditional opportunities. And that's really what led me to writing this book. It was about what, what are the non traditional roles out there? And for me specifically, because I did have a career in pharma and I've worked in pharma and I've, uh, you know, done a lot in pharma, and I have a lot of pharmacy students. I still precept at Rutgers and at FDU and St. John's, and I have students all the time who are asking me these questions. I think that it's important to let pharmacy students know, pharmacists out there, that if you do not like what you are doing, the The best thing about pharmacy is that you can pivot and there are many other roles out there. You're not just, you know, well, I'm trained this way and this is all I can do. There are many other ways to find your, your niche or your area of interest really.

Phil: 8:28

Absolutely. And that's really a hard thing as a, as a parent, but I think it, I think moms have double bad, like you watch it with them because there's just. I'm a father, I'm a father of four boys, and I would do anything for my kids. And when my kids were under five, like, those are the best years of my life, and those are the years I spent most in the pharmacy. And I, I often look back on those years, and I think, if I could go back for just a minute and grab one of my three year olds and just hug them and just stay home for the day, I would do it. But you also have this pressure where you need to be able to provide for those children. And I think that that's like a universal, It is a universal struggle that everybody will have. I think, I think anybody that works will always have it. What I really love about what you've done. Is instead of being weak and staying at home and just letting it eat you alive. You're like, I have to go help other people. I know you say you were looking for help, but part of what you were out there saying is we need a community. To me that that's a big leap of faith and there's no way that that group you've started is easy to manage and to keep up with and, and everything else. So have you found it to be rewarding even with all the work?

Suzy: 9:36

Oh, I love it. I don't even think, you know, it's not work at all for me. I love it. It's, you know, I get messages, like I said, every day, multiple, multiple messages. In fact, I'm probably so far behind on my messages that I don't always respond to people, but I do get around to it eventually. And, um, for me, it's amazing because you really get to touch upon people's lives and you get to see the different, um, stages where parents are. So you're kind of like the new mom who's preparing and. You know, I'm going to be nursing and you know, can I pump in the pharmacy? And where do I pump and what should I do? And the pharmacist moms group actually, we worked on initiatives towards that towards having a clean space to be able to pump if you're working in a pharmacy and all of that. And then you see some of the pharmacists who are near retirement and all of their thoughts on, you know, this is what I did. And this is how you know, you could manage this. And this is so it's Really well balanced. And I, and I love that about the group and that we're all over because a lot of times pharmacists we operate in silo, right? We're all alone. Sometimes we have a tech or two with us, but really we're alone. So, um, even yesterday there was someone asking about dosing in the group. They were just asking, like, can someone else check on this dose for me really quickly? I don't have time. I need someone else to just tell me I'm doing this correctly. And I think that's the most valuable part is that you have an instant community of like minded peers who are able to answer the questions and help. Um, there's been instances where someone's like, you know what, my mother in law is really sick. She's in this state. Do you work at this hospital? Are you able to go visit her? Are you able to go do I can't get back to my parents and you know, my dad just had a heart attack. And is anyone working at this hospital? Can they help? And I think That's really where I see the, you know, for me, it's such a blessing to be able to see all of. You know, the women working together to help, help each other.

Phil: 11:27

Absolutely. Do you happen to have a favorite story that you, like, because I always have, like, when I think about my career in the pharmacy, I have two or three stories that when days are really bad, I just remember those. Do you have a one or two stories or a story that jumps out to you that you always lean back on when you're thinking, okay, this is a lot of work?

Suzy: 11:47

Yeah, I think for me it was that when a pharmacist lost their home and she lost her home due to a natural disaster and that the group came together to purchase items for her, for her family, for her kids. And, um, this was early on when the group was still fairly small, but it was really nice. Her house was destroyed in a tornado and, um, she just had a lot of stress going on at the time and we were able to, uh, really help her. And then, um, Another one was a woman who was a pharmacist was looking for a stem cell or a bone marrow transplant at the time, uh, match. And so we were trying to really help her. So there are, there are stories like that, where you just come together as a community and it really does make a difference. And then you see, you know, we're all working for the same purpose and trying to help each other.

Phil: 12:39

Absolutely. Now we were talking earlier because you have an injured ankle and we were talking about how How you probably were, I know how exactly set it, but it seems like you've always got two or three hats on at any given time, because it's not like we talk about being, I'm a pharmacist and I do this little social media thing that I'm doing. Like that's all I do. Right. But you've got. You've got school. You've been an associate dean and a dean of different things while you've been owning pharmacies. Plus you have a couple of kids. Is that right?

Suzy: 13:10

Yeah. Yeah. We have five kids. So we have four boys and a girl too.

Phil: 13:14

Oh, so that's like, and you're balancing all of this stuff. So I'm going to ask first, do you ever sleep? With that big of a schedule?

Suzy: 13:21

Now I sleep. It's funny. Yeah. Um, but I, so yes, I sleep, I sleep early though. My kids always laugh. They're like, mom, you're, you go to bed so early. I mean, even last night, my son had all his soccer friends. We had a pasta dinner here last night and I'm like, I need to go to bed. And these, in these high school kids, they don't, they don't really like to go to bed. That's what I'm learning right now.

Phil: 13:41

So how old is your oldest now?

Suzy: 13:43

Uh, 18.

Phil: 13:44

Oh, see, that's fun. So you've got five under the age of 18 right now.

Suzy: 13:49

Yeah.

Phil: 13:49

Oh, you're in the mix of it.

Suzy: 13:52

So it's busy, but I mean, for me, it's just, you know, I've always, I've loved pharmacy. I think for me, I knew that I didn't want to go the traditional route. I never went the traditional route. I think, you know, I, I knew. How to work in a pharmacy and what to do. But for me, I was always looking for non traditional things that pharmacists can do. And well, we have all this knowledge and why aren't we doing this? And why aren't we doing this? And I'd always be that one person. I mean, from back when I was in pharmacy school, well, why can't we do this? I mean, until now, I'm like, why can't we diagnose? Like, why don't they put that into the curriculum?

Phil: 14:24

Right.

Suzy: 14:25

And then we could diagnose it, but I see that, you know, there's a lot of organizations that don't want us to do that, and there's a lot of politics behind that, but,

Phil: 14:33

um, But isn't it partially because, okay, so this is my take on pharmacists, you ready? Yeah. For some reason, we all work alone, so we all are on our own little islands, and for some reason, each one of us thinks that our island is the only tribe, and we've never bonded together. If we ever realize we're all the same tribe, pharmacists are the most accessible health care provider. There's nobody else you can walk up to a counter and say, Hey, I have this issue. And. For routine things, things that have been previously diagnosed, things like that, we know what to do with those things. Like I always come in and, you know, and I think to myself, why can't I put refills on somebody's blood pressure medication? Why can't I watch their cholesterol medication? Um, they come to talk to me about what they should do with their antidepressants. And so one of the things I've always thought is there should be an option for pharmacists to be able to prescribe. And it seems like if we did that, that would open up a lot of healthcare. If you could make a change or maybe three changes in pharmacy today that you dare say out loud because you know There's a lot of people with a lot of power. So just be careful What are three things you would change about being a pharmacist that you would open up like today if you could?

Suzy: 15:41

The first thing. So the first thing would be to be able to diagnose/prescribe. I think that that would be important because I think pharmacists are capable of that. We have a wealth of knowledge. I mean, I see what my pharmacy students come out for their rotations with me. I mean, they know They know everything. I mean, they're, they're in tip top shape when it comes to every medication out there, every supplement. I mean, they're now they know everything. And so I really think that if they added that into the curriculum and we were able to, you know, do a little bit more, I mean, just giving the refills like you're, you're talking about on blood pressure, if someone's on it for, you know, being able to check their blood pressure and say, Okay, let's keep them on it. And let's do this. I definitely think that's something that needs to change. I think, uh, that pharmacists need to advocate for themselves a little bit more. I think that pharmacists are also to blame partially because I think that we need to rather than saying this is what we can't do. This is what we can't do. I mean, they've been talking about what we can't do since I was in pharmacy school. So I think we need to start saying like, okay, we can do all of this. And how are we going to be able to do more? And I know there, again, there are organizations out there who are like, no, pharmacists aren't going to be allowed to do that. Cause that might take our job or that might take. Someone else's job. And so there there are politics, but I think if pharmacists came together to work on this, I think to your point, we are the most accessible health care professional out there. So I think that would make a difference. I also think pharmacists need to stop giving so much free advice. So, um, I think we give a lot of free advice. I think people call us, I get text messages from my friends constantly, which is fine because they're my friends. But, you know, people are asking for just advice and all, and all of that, and pharmacists feel bad to actually charge money. So I always mention this, I, I did work in a clinic, um, in New Jersey and it was in, it was in the city and it was a great clinic and I was charging at the time,$250 an hour cash to see a patient. And these were affluent patients on the Upper West Side of Manhattan, and so they could afford it, and they were interested. But I always think about that, that people will pay to speak to their pharmacist. They, they will pay them. You just, you might need to find the right patient population. And I know it's not always covered by insurance, but I think if you find those patients, pharmacists should start charging. So I think that one thing we should do is be able to bill or be able to charge for some You know, some of our skills or some of our advice that we, that we provide to people.

Phil: 18:16

Absolutely. And I, I am 100% behind you. In fact, I'm going to be honest with you. I'm going to push really hard. One of the things I wanted to do, if I ever, I promised if I ever got to a point where I had any voice, there were a few things. And one of them was, is that we should be able to prescribe. There's going to be some nuances to it. And there's a few States, including Utah that have put it out there that after primary diagnosis, pharmacists can prescribe. Because there are a lot of areas right now that are lacking of healthcare. And I think that as much as we talk about our profession as a way, because we are in there, I look at the patient populations and I know what they're going through. There's a reason why they come to the pharmacist. It's not just because we're accessible. It's because we've created a place where they can trust and they feel like it's, They can be there. And so I say we get them together. I mean, it's time. You are just amazing. So if you and me and a few others just really pushed, I think we can do it. Like, I honestly think we can change the world.

Suzy: 19:11

We should do it. I think we're doing it. Yeah.

Phil: 19:14

And then the other thing I always think about is, is that when you got to get a cup of coffee, it costs you$5, right? I feel somebody's Digoxin that they could die. And I get$1.98 so the idea that there's not a minimum like let's give time to the pharmacist to make sure it's safe on those lower end medications is crazy to me, considering we spend more money on prescription drugs than any other country in the world.

Suzy: 19:39

100%. I think it's crazy when I used to tell people that. I wouldn't get paid for filling a medication. These were my non pharmacy friends. They would be like, what are you talking about? How do you not? I'm like, no, I'm losing money filling this Medicaid and people don't, other pharmacists even didn't believe me. They'd be like, what do you mean you're losing money filling this?

Phil: 19:57

And you're like, I could give this person$3 and tell them to go next door and be out less money. Or$5. Like it's insane. People don't understand how many, and it's a lot. It's like 27% of all generic drugs are now negative reimbursed for independent pharmacies. So you're, you're better off not filling it and you fill them because you do care. Like every day you look at that negative reimbursement. You're like, I like this person. I like this person.

Suzy: 20:22

Yeah.

Phil: 20:22

And that's a terrible place to put pharmacists at. And now I think that it's got bad enough that I think there's finally a chance for us to take Mothers like you, I don't care what jobs they're in, they shouldn't have to work 10 hour days, not see their kids, and not know that their job's secure. Like, that's just not, that's not cool. That's not, you know, cause they work so hard and it's not just pharmacists. That's the technicians. I can't believe what technicians do for as little as they get.

Suzy: 20:51

100%. Yes. 100%.

Phil: 20:53

I would quit and I would go to McDonald's like that's how, you know, cause they could make more money and I swear the hours would be better. It'd be less stressful, you know, cause you're not getting screamed at. And, you know, And very few people die from eating bad meat, you know, so

Suzy: 21:06

You might get yelled at if you put if you don't put enough ketchup or barbecue sauce, but that's about it, right?

Phil: 21:11

Right. You're not sitting in front of a board or something like that. Like there's not all those other things. And so I, you know, the as pharmacy goes, I think that we need to take away from those that are making the very most like yesterday they had Ozempic in front of the Senate. Did you see that?

Suzy: 21:25

I saw that. Yes.

Phil: 21:27

And they're talking about the rebates and how this whole thing works. And you're like, all the pharmacy people in the pharmacy world realize. Pharmacists are getting$7 for this prescription. The patient's paying$500 for it. So where's the money at? And the money is already in the system. And I think pharmacists, if we advocate for ourselves, we could change it so every patient in the United States wants to give their pharmacist a hug because we could fix it if we got together. But for some reason, we just like, we're like crabs in a pot. We just keep dragging each other down. And I, I think we can fix it without, I think people are ready.

Suzy: 22:01

I think they are ready. I think, you know, I mean, I have 45,000 people behind us right now too. I think all these pharmacies in my group are all, they're ready. I mean, I think people are ready for change and I read it all the time. You know, they're, they're ready. You know,

Phil: 22:15

Let's do it. You know what? I'll get I've got some friends. We'll, we'll draw up some legislation and we'll go march on Washington, DC together. Can you imagine for the first time ever having a 100,000 pharmacists all marching like for the first time getting a little attention that we don't want to have what we have those dangerous situations. I get more questions about weight loss, drugs than anything else right now. Are they safe? Can I stay on them for long term? And yeah, I have a few concerns because you have to ask yourself, why did we need the shot in the first place? Our bodies produce GLP one inside the L cells. And those are found inside your small intestine. Whatever you could do to help those L cells produce its own GLP would be immensely important. And in this case, Triquetra got GLP Activate. GLP Activate combines multiple products in order to help your own L cells be the healthiest they can. And when the L cells happy you put out your own GLP and you don't have to take those shots. It also puts the amount that your body is used to having. So you can go back to the way it was GLP activate. So you want to go right now to TriquetraHealth.com and put in code GLP120. Get your GLP Activate, figure out what's going on in there instead of just trying to overwhelm it. Last year, did you watch all the CVS walkouts?

Suzy: 23:34

I did. Yeah. Yeah.

Phil: 23:35

So explain it a little bit to the audience because I talk way too much in this thing. You're taking it.

Suzy: 23:40

No, it's fine. I mean, I think a lot of pharmacists, you know, what's interesting is actually something came up just yesterday too. So it's similar to the CVS walkout. So the CVS walkouts were that pharmacists were pretty much fed up and they're feeling burnt out and, uh, they, they, You know, need more help and they wanted they did get their bathroom break or their lunch breaks, but it's still not enough. And interestingly, yesterday, last night, actually, in my group, this is a video going viral right now. And I feel bad for the pharmacist and I really want her to know that. We're behind her and we support her. But she, uh, someone, a patient came in the pharmacy and was yelling at her. Her pharmacy super busy. I believe it was a CVS. There were like four different other people crying, screaming, and someone happened to be videoing it, put it on TikTok. It already has over a million views. And she just went a little, she was upset and she shut all the, she just pulled the curtain down because people were screaming at her. She shut the blinds and said, you know, I'm going crazy and I need to, I need a break right now.

Phil: 24:40

And, and how unsafe is that situation? Like people, you see how they're frustrated. We actually understand your frustration better than you do as much as you think you do. Cause we actually see everything that's going on. We know how hard it is. It's unsafe. Like it's truly unsafe in that situation.

Suzy: 24:54

Yes, it is unsafe. And then you have people there. There was a woman there who was asking for her cancer medication. I believe they were saying in the I watched the video after it. And it's just it really is unsafe. And that's what we need to talk about. And, uh, you know, how our patients are going to get their medication and I think, um, talking about the feelings that these pharmacists have, like working all these hours, not feeling supported, not having another pharmacist there or someone to help them and, um, you know,

Phil: 25:25

I think she's brave. I think that was a brave thing. Most, most of the time pharmacists just keep taking it on the nose. Like, you know.

Suzy: 25:32

Yeah. No, they do. You're right. And that's what happens. But she was, you know, she was brave enough to do it and, and she got filmed. So I don't know what the consequences will be if, you know, if she'll lose her job or what will happen or not happen, but I know there's a lot of people who are behind her right now. And I think.

Phil: 25:47

And we'll find her one. If she, if she loses her job, we'll find her one. We'll just reach out to everybody we know. We'll find her one. Because it comes down to the situation is as frustrated as you are in that pharmacy at that moment. The second they put the wrong pill in that bottle or the second you don't get the attention you need, you're going to be a lot worse off. So it takes a lot. Um, I was listening to one of your podcasts and one of the questions you always deal with is how to deal with difficult situation. It was one of the Coffee with Suzy episodes on your podcast I was listening to. And you kind of talked about how generally, and I think this is really true of a lot of people, they don't, they'll do everything not to have conflict, which then creates more toxicity within them.

Suzy: 26:25

100%. Yes. I mean, and they do that. And pharmacists are noted, like they're kind of known to do that. They're most pharmacists are conflict avoiders, and they're, you know, the person who did well in school, and they're a rule follower, and they, you know, they always were raising their hand and getting the answer correct.

Phil: 26:42

You're speaking to like the whole audience because there's so many people who are just like, we always bring up pharmacists, but like, you're speaking to what I hear. From my audience all the time that they live in fight or flight all the time and they're just trying to dodge things.

Suzy: 26:54

Exactly. Yeah. So it can come up whether it's in your professional life or your personal life, you know, but really you need to face the issue. And the earlier you face it, the better. And it starts out. I mean, In middle school, you can think about it. There might be a conflict where a kid feels, you know what, they were bothering me. They were making fun of me. And does that kid just go avoid them and go play with a different group? Or does that kid say, you know what, you bothered me? And the other kid's like, Oh, no, don't worry. I'm sorry. And then the other kid's like, Okay, I forgive you. And you learn how to resolve it right there on the playground or, you know, are you just avoiding each other permanently after that and you're like, okay, well, I'm not going to talk to you and I'm not going to talk to you and, and, and it can happen in the workplace, which makes it even more difficult because then you're working with that person and, and they're disgruntled and, and you're disgruntled and, and, you know, it doesn't make set up for a successful work environment either.

Phil: 27:46

No, and then you get these toxic feelings towards people that are inside your head, like you give them a power inside of you because you're going through scenario after scenario after scenario, like you've, you had this conflict, you didn't do anything with it, so the rest of the day you're like, oh, I should have said, or I should have done. And by the time you're done, you're in this like super negative cycle. You know, before, when I was in my own little store, in my own little world, I used to see people and my wife would ask me, are there more good people or bad people in the world? And so I'm going to ask you, do you think there's more good people in the world or bad people? Because your world is huge now with 45,000 people.

Suzy: 28:22

You know, I still think good. Personally, I think there's more good. I that's my belief. Um, it's funny because my husband has asked me that as well. And, um, but I still think good. I think in general. You know, good. I think that they good people might do bad things sometimes, but I think at the core, we're all still looking for love and you know in acceptance and in all of that. So I think personally, I've seen a lot of good and I've seen a lot of good come out of the group I do think that there's moments in time where people might not be happy for you, or they're, I mean, even within my group, there's women who are like, Oh, why is she talking about this? And she's always talking about that. And I mean, there's catfights and they live a million miles apart. So that's going to happen regardless.

Phil: 29:08

And I actually 100% agree with you. I think there's lots more good people. And I think if you listen to the people who are. Maybe saying or doing the things that are bad and you hear them and you see why they're, they would say what they do. It's so, like, that's the thing. I'm, my perspective has changed on a lot of things. I used to think they were villains in the world and now I realize it's just everybody trying to get through life.

Suzy: 29:29

Yeah.

Phil: 29:30

And the second we stop fighting and we start listening, no matter where you're at, You're like, Oh, well, there is a solution and I, and I think I, that's why I love what you've done. Like, it's really hard to manage anything that has this many voices in it.

Suzy: 29:44

Yeah. I mean, thank you. It's, I think, yeah, listening is important and listening is key. I think with that, just like with your patients, right. Or with anyone, even your followers on social media, it's listening to what people are asking and what they're saying and what, what they're in need of, um, as well. I think that's important. I always say this and I'm a pharmacist, but I'm always like, you don't just. Give a, you know, a medication first, you have to get to like the root cause and you have to understand why things happening before you just go pop a pill and numb everything away. So

Phil: 30:13

Look at that. You tied right in. I started the podcast because I had so many people who got tired of just going in and speaking to a health care provider, whoever they are. They would listen about four symptoms and say, here, take this medicine and send them out the door. And then they don't take it. And we're like, well, if you just took it, it'd be fine. You know, they're like, just exercise, just get rid of stress. And they haven't even stopped to say, okay, what, what do you want? And I love that you've asked yourself, what do you want? I've watched you and, and really Suzy, you're one of the smartest people I've ever interviewed to talk to at all. Like you're, you're just brilliant in every single way. And so I'm going to say your book again, cause we're going to do it because I have two more questions, but I want to make sure I say it right The Ultimate Guide to Becoming a Medical Science Liaison. So you can find your way. Instead of having to be told for anybody that's looking into pharmacy to become one who is in there or is currently thinking, I can't do another day here.

Suzy: 31:10

Yes.

Phil: 31:11

Which is a lot of them. Before you give up on it, realize that we are pushing boundaries that Suzy and I are starting the revolution. It's going right now. We're doing this thing. Like, I'm serious. In the next four years, you're going to see some major things at least make noise because pharmacists will help people. And that's really what both Suzy and I want. But big question I have for you. You have five kids.

Suzy: 31:32

Yeah.

Phil: 31:32

I have four. I get this one all the time. Would you have your, your kids become pharmacists?

Suzy: 31:40

I get this question all the time, too. So it's quite interesting you ask, and I feel like it's, um, loaded. But I, I think I always tell my children this. I say, whatever you are going to be, be the best at it. So I think if you're going to go become a pharmacist and you're going to be a mediocre pharmacist or a subpar pharmacist, then don't be a pharmacist. If you're going to be the pharmacist who is like complaining every day, and I can't do this, and this is terrible, and this field sucks, and I don't want to be, you know, then, then don't go into pharmacy. I think, you know, if you want to, be, go be a barber, go be a barber, but be that go, you know, go, I don't know, be the best barber out there, you know, and I think for me, that's what I really tell my children. And I think that for me, I love pharmacy. I've made a career, you know, my whole life is pharmacy, but I really wanted to do more for the profession. And I've done a lot of different things in pharmacy, whether I've worked in a hospital or independent and I've worked in pharma. I've worked in academia, so I've done a lot in pharmacy and, um, you know, been an author and did did a lot of different things and research or presented research in the area. And there's so much that we can do as pharmacists. I think that Sometimes we limit ourselves. And I think that's really what my whole purpose is now is really to let pharmacists know, like you have this degree, you have this knowledge. So now use it and you can use it in so many ways. You don't just have to use it as like this little career and you're on this trajectory for 45 years until you retire. And really you, you can do, you can pivot and you can switch and you can find whatever makes you happy and feeds your soul.

Phil: 33:21

That's just great advice for anybody. And making that pivot is. Enormously scary like um, yeah three years ago. I started social media. It was enormously scary to me I wanted to hide in my little hidey hold I find myself even still. Even with success that I find in life, the first thing any of us do when we make change is want to run back to that thing that we know, even though that thing that we know may be the worst thing in our life.

Suzy: 33:45

Always. Yeah, exactly. That's what we, that's what we do. But you found the most success. I mean, you're, you're great at what you do and I feel like you're educating so many people on, um, you know, on pharmacy, so.

Phil: 33:56

Well, and I love all of your content. I was telling you before this, like, your content is so much better put together. Mine's like, hectic, and people are trying to figure out what's go they have to watch it three times just to figure out.

Suzy: 34:06

No, I love it! It's so entertaining! I'm like, very entertained by you, so.

Phil: 34:10

Yours is always straightforward and really great information. But I do think there's a lot of people who are listening in general that I would say to them that just because you feel like you know something doesn't mean it's the best thing for you and especially as you get older when you're younger, you'll you'll make changes pretty quickly. One day you're hanging out with one group of friends and the other. As we get older, when you start to look at things that make you feel less than. You just have to make that change in that first 30 days is really hard. And when you do that, though, it opens up your world to possibilities that are just incredible. And Suzy's a great example of someone who's done that. You look at what she's done in her resume. She's got five kids. She's done so much schooling. It's incredible. She has enough letters behind her name that she could spell brilliant right out. I seriously think it's there. And I look at someone like you and I, and I, and I put it out there to the world saying, you don't have to be what you don't want to be. Just keep pushing. And you're just such a great example of that.

Suzy: 35:11

Thank you. Yeah. No, I mean, that's what have to keep pushing. I mean, you have to, if you're not happy with what you're doing, I just, I always tell a lot of my pharmacy students, that's just find where you are happy. And if you're, if it's not speaking joy or, you know, you're not finding happiness there, then that's not for you. I tell my kids the same thing, then you have to find what does make you feel at peace and what brings you peace. So, uh, and I think a lot of pharmacists are like, well, this is fine and this is what I do. And, you know, and. I think you need to find something that really will feed you because otherwise you get to 40, 45 years old and you're like, what did I do with my life? Like, why, why did I, why didn't I do more? Why didn't I do that? And I see, I just see all the stories from all of these women in my group and, uh, you know, and I, and I see the differences.

Phil: 35:55

But 45 is not too late. Like that's

Suzy: 35:57

Never that's what I'm saying. So you can change at 45.

Phil: 36:00

Yeah thanks to inflation we'll work till 70 anyway.

Suzy: 36:02

You're like ready for your next career. That's what I always say. I'm like, so if you get to 40 and 45, and you're like, you know, why did I waste myself doing this? Like, It's time to do something different. Like you, you, you're able to do it. You don't have to continue doing the same thing forever.

Phil: 36:16

And it's the same with kids. Like, I think that's the same thing with children. You're like, okay, this is what I do. And this is where we're at. And you can wake up the next morning and say, I'm going to be just 1% different today. And then 1% different the next day. And we're going to change to where I want to be. Okay. So the last question I ask everybody is, um, when I started social media, I just wanted to save my store and it moved a lot bigger than I expected, which I think you probably can relate with. You're like, what in the world's going on here? So then I had somebody asked me, he said, he told me that you had a chance to have a platform. You need to start thinking about what you really want from this. And I came up with the idea that if we could make the world 1% kinder, it would be a success in my life. If I could just make the world 1% kinder. And so I always end by telling everybody to go find somebody, give them a hug. Tell somebody who's yelling at you something nice, do something just to make the world 1% kinder. But, Suzy, if you could give advice to people how they could make the world 1% kinder, what would you say?

Suzy: 37:14

So, I think it's, like, I actually have a story about this.

Phil: 37:17

Oh, good. Tell the story.

Suzy: 37:18

I go to the gym all the time, and everyone's really friendly. I love going to the gym. And there's one guy that works at the front desk, and he, I would love for him to even listen to this, but he probably doesn't even listen to anything. But he's always disgruntled and he works at the front desk and, you know, I'll, I'll sign in and I'm like, hi, how are you? Nothing. I mean, nothing. He's just always just like, I'm like, what's your name? You know, blah, blah, blah. And he's just always angry or upset. And, you know, I don't know. And then I thought it was me. I'm like, maybe he doesn't like me. Like, maybe he's just like, Oh, this old lady's here. And why, you know, like, why is she bothering me? And, um, Yeah. And anyway, to make a long story short, I've been killing him with kindness, right? I've been like all the time. I'm like, how are you? Where, where'd you grow up? Do you have any siblings? So like, I started like, Like kind of breaking him down and my other friends at the gym all talk about him. They're always like, Oh, he's so rude. I don't know why he works here, blah, blah, blah. But now he's been so nice to me like the past month, all of a sudden it's been great. He's even like, would you like a free water bottle? Would you like, you know, would you like this? And it's so Um, so my advice is that if someone is rude, and I come to find out that he had a much more difficult life or more like he's been opening up to me, I think too, so I think if you encounter someone who is rude that know that everyone is dealing with something and everyone has a story and so don't take it so personally. I think a lot of people take it personally and they're like, oh, he's really rude and it's it's my fault. Or, you know, he doesn't like me, but. You know, that person is probably facing something else that you probably don't know about. And so I think that just trying to be nice, regardless, even if someone is really rude, which I know is sometimes difficult, but, um, I tell my kids that too. And, and then, and sometimes it works. And sometimes all of a sudden they'll, you know, they'll friend you.

Phil: 39:06

Oh, I love that. I do love that because I saw a quote the other day that says when you take something personally just remember they're not actually thinking about you the way you are. So And so I love that. All right. Well, this has been Take Your Medicine podcast I'm, Phil Cowley. If you like the episode come and follow us. Also make sure you go look up@drsuzannesoliman on Instagram. Go check out her book. The Ultimate Guide to Becoming a Medical Science Liaison. It's on Amazon. It's all over the place and you can find it on her website as well. She is absolutely brilliant in every way. And thank you so much for being on.

Suzy: 39:43

Thank you. Thanks so much for having me.